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Joker: Folie à Deux is not a commentary on fan entitlement or toxic fandom, writer-director Todd Phillips has said. In a new interview, Phillips said that, instead, the sequel is about what happens to a person who has a title thrust upon them that they never truly wanted. In this case, Phillips is referring to how Joaquin Phoenix’s Arthur Fleck takes on the title of Joker because it gives him meaning and significance in his otherwise sad life. This story contains spoilers for Joker: Folie à Deux.
Talking to IGN, Phillips said, “It was never about addressing toxic fandom, but it was about addressing this idea of what happens if this thing gets put upon you… but it’s not actually what you are.”
Going further, Phillips said the movie also explores how Arthur reacts in the “worst-case scenario,” which for him is when Lee (Lady Gaga) confirms that she is only in love with Fleck’s Joker persona, and not the man.
In the first Joker movie, Arthur says he doesn’t believe in anything and opted to take on the Joker persona only because it would be good for his comedy act. Robert De Niro’s character, Murray, was the one who suggested Arthur go by the name Joker as a means of insulting and humiliating him for better ratings on his show. Arthur goes on to murder Franklin on live TV as a means of getting revenge.
Also in the interview, Phillips once again defended the 2019 Joker movie, saying he believes it was, in fact, a “responsible” film because it showed how violence can affect people. “It wasn’t glamorizing gun use in my mind. It was actually showing, ‘Oh my God, this is brutal,'” he said. “And I think the reality of it maybe is what turned people off, the people that were turned off.”
Phillips said he was trying to convey a similar message in the sequel, and this is hammered home in a courtroom scene where Arthur is cross-examining Gary (Leigh Gill). In this scene, Gary is traumatized by the violence Arthur showed in the first movie–brutally killing a man in front of him–and this was a turning point for Arthur.
“It’s two, three years later in the movie and Gary still says he can’t sleep and he still wasn’t able to go back to work,” Phillips said. “These effects of violence was something we really wanted to kind of–at least that scene addresses some part of it, but not so much toxic fandom honestly, but it’s a good idea.”
The big twist in Folie à Deux is that Arthur owns up to his crimes and rejects his Joker persona, after which Lee abandons him, leaving him a sad, lonely soul once again. He was never the “real” Joker.
Folie à Deux has GameSpot’s breakdown of the film’s shocking ending. You can also read up on what might have gone wrong with the sequel behind the scenes.
